Some things I've noticed...

[Guest]

When setting up the project in Vault through dreamweaver, it tries to add the name of the Project as the folder the project will reside in. I'm sure that sounds odd, so I'll try and give an example. By the way this was not an expected result, which is why I'm bringing it up.

Let's say I have my project in dreamweaver named: "Dev site - domain.com"

And the folder I store the site in on my local computer is located in: "domain.com"

When I go to set up vault to where the site is located, it automatically adds on the "Dev site - domain.com" onto the end of whatever I specify as the working folder. An unexpected result. The working folder should only go to where I specify, not add the name of the project onto the end of it. Right? Otherwise it would seem I would lose the ability to custom name my dreamweaver sites.

Next thing I noticed.

When working in source control in dreamweaver with other solutions, using the get/put feature of the pull down menu (right click on a file in your site, you'll see the check in/check out and the get/put items) automatically defaults to the test server since the remote server is defined as the source control server. At the current moment, both get/put and check in/check out will go to the source control server.

In order to get/put properly, I need to go to "Expand local/remote sites" button under the files tab, below the location drop down list. Then select 'remote view' and connect, then upload. This is instead of just using the built in get/put from the site editing view.

Did that make sense?

[dan]

When setting up the project in Vault through dreamweaver, it tries to add the name of the Project as the folder the project will reside in. I'm sure that sounds odd, so I'll try and give an example. By the way this was not an expected result, which is why I'm bringing it up.

Let's say I have my project in dreamweaver named: "Dev site - domain.com"

And the folder I store the site in on my local computer is located in: "domain.com"

When I go to set up vault to where the site is located, it automatically adds on the "Dev site - domain.com" onto the end of whatever I specify as the working folder. An unexpected result. The working folder should only go to where I specify, not add the name of the project onto the end of it. Right? Otherwise it would seem I would lose the ability to custom name my dreamweaver sites.

The site name here is just a default (in the Set Vault Working Folder dialog), and can be changed, which will change the name of the Vault folder that will be created. Note that you can remove the site name entirely in that dialog and it will not create an extra level of subfolder for the site name, but put files directly in the Vault folder you specify.

We made sure to display the Vault folder path in that dialog that will be used, to try to cut down on confusion. However, so far we've had two comments about this, both of which indicate it is confusing Is there anything you can think of that would make it less confusing?

Next thing I noticed.

When working in source control in dreamweaver with other solutions, using the get/put feature of the pull down menu (right click on a file in your site, you'll see the check in/check out and the get/put items) automatically defaults to the test server since the remote server is defined as the source control server. At the current moment, both get/put and check in/check out will go to the source control server.

In order to get/put properly, I need to go to "Expand local/remote sites" button under the files tab, below the location drop down list. Then select 'remote view' and connect, then upload. This is instead of just using the built in get/put from the site editing view.

Did that make sense?

Hopefully we haven't totally misunderstood what put/get means, but we tried to follow the SourceSafe plugin as the example of how SCC systems should behave.

Our understanding is that Put/Get on the context menu (right clicking on a file) are the tranfser of files between the local folder and the source control folder (in fact, Dreamweaver calls Vault when these commands are invoked, so we can put/get files to/from Vault). I don't believe these are intended to work for the test server.

However, that begs the question of what is the easiest way to syncronize with the test server, and I must admit that we are still not Dreamweaver experts. It seems that selecting "Testing Server" in the files tab and invoking Put will places files from the local folder to the testing server, and Get will transfer them from the testing server to the local folder.

We may be wrong about all this, but I'd like to ask if you've used VSS or other source control systems that work differently with Dreamweaver. We mostly want to work the way other SCC systems do.

[Guest]

I'm not sure I would have a prompt for the "Site Name" at all.

I think the problem is the user feels as if they're supposed to fill in some sort of text in the "Site Name" text box which is confusing because we (as users) aren't sure if the "Site Name" field is required or if we're allowed to leave it blank.

Since the folder already exists in Vault that the user is browsing too (at least in every case I can think of...) then there shouldn't be any need to have a "Site Name" field. Just have the user click on the folder the files should go to and call it a day. The confusing part is when the folder you click on that the project should go to, it then appends the "Site Name" at the end of it making the user thing they might be selecting the incorrect folder.

In the case the folder doesn't exist, maybe put a "New Folder" button next to the "Refresh Tree" button and allow the user to create a new folder within the tree view interface rather than in the section containing their local file path. That might be the confusing part: that the user assumes the top part of the window is for their local computer, and the part labeled "Full Path of Vault Folder for Site" is purely for the vault folder assignment/creation.

[Guest]

Put/Get:

I could be remembering this entirely wrong as I haven't worked with SourceSafe in Dreamweaver in over 4 years so you'll have to forgive me if I'm way off base. That said Put/Get seem to me to do the same exact thing as Check in/Check out if a vault server is assigned. If they do the same thing, there's really no reason to having both of them.

Since it'd be much more useful to have them do different things, I'd make the put/get access the Test Server if it's defined rather than put/get to source control. So we have two use cases for put/get if a vault server is defined:

a) Test server defined - Put/Get would put/get files from test server.

b) Test server undefined - Put would be disabled. Get would get latest from Vault.

It's possible that put/get are there because there isn't a "Get latest version" available in the Dreamweaver interface, although in that instance, you could have a checkbox/radio group in the Vault settings window (when you select your Remote server) that would "Make 'get' act like 'get latest version'" OR "Make 'put/get' send to Test server". That way the user could define their action for the menu option.

I don't know how the API for dreamweaver works, but if it's possible to add a "Get latest version" to the right click menu, that would probably clear things up greatly and then allow the put/get to be better used with the Test server.

[dan]

Site Name:

I've wanted to put a New Folder button there anyway, so it probably makes sense to do that. I'll have to think about this some more and see what we can come up with.

Get/Put:

These are all good ideas, but they are beyond the control of Vault, because Dreamweaver determines what these commands do. For instance, we don't have access to any information about the Test Server, so it would be impossible for us to put files there.

Also, we want to be compatible with how every other SCC tool works in DW, so I'm not seeing anything in this topic that we can really do much about. You might want to load another SCC tool (like VSS) and compare how it works to Vault to see what I mean.

[Don Thimsen]

Dan and Guest

The site name here is just a default (in the Set Vault Working Folder dialog), and can be changed, which will change the name of the Vault folder that will be created. Note that you can remove the site name entirely in that dialog and it will not create an extra level of subfolder for the site name, but put files directly in the Vault folder you specify.

We made sure to display the Vault folder path in that dialog that will be used, to try to cut down on confusion. However, so far we've had two comments about this, both of which indicate it is confusing Is there anything you can think of that would make it less confusing?

I suggest not using ANY default... And even if you set the default, using the DW site name is a bad idea. At our company, each DW user has a different site name defined (ie. I use DTS and another person uses DTS Website). Heck, I probably use a different name on my home copy of DW.

Suggestion: On the Settings screen, lose the Site Name field. Letting the user pick from the tree, and display the Vault Path name in an "editable" field. That way the user can change the path name to create an entry as necessary - like many of the windows installers allow target directory location. Then maybe prompt the user if it's a create situation...


One other thing I noticed when I was testing this morning... If I checkout a file in local view, then switch to testing view and then return to local view, the local view will no longer have the checkout indicator. Checkin is no longer an option on the context menu. If you go to remote view, it shows as checked out. If you return to local view from remove view at this point, the checkout situation is then fixed...

I'm also not convinced that using a testing server will work well to deploy to a production server. I never did find a way to deploy a new webpage to production. Since it's not on the Testing Server yet, there is no way to use PUT from testing view...

We'll probably just use an external method of synching the production site.

Don

[Guest]

Site Name:

I've wanted to put a New Folder button there anyway, so it probably makes sense to do that. I'll have to think about this some more and see what we can come up with.

Get/Put:

These are all good ideas, but they are beyond the control of Vault, because Dreamweaver determines what these commands do. For instance, we don't have access to any information about the Test Server, so it would be impossible for us to put files there.

Also, we want to be compatible with how every other SCC tool works in DW, so I'm not seeing anything in this topic that we can really do much about. You might want to load another SCC tool (like VSS) and compare how it works to Vault to see what I mean.

I feared as much, thanks for looking into it. Maybe there's something I did on the client end to simulate the experience I remember. I just figured it was a default set up in the SCC api guess I was mistaken.

[dan]

OK, on the site name issue, chalk this up to us not knowing how people actually use the site name. We'll need to redesign that dialogue to not add the site name, and also allow users to create subfolders so they can place the site exactly where they want it.

Thanks for the feedback!

[Guest]

No problem, and thanks for listening Dan

-Jesse